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Buren Ameland,West Frisian Islands, Netherlands

Dear AG pumpkin growers,

Since yesterday I did not know red Atlantic Giant pumpkins excisted....
But now I know, due to the interesting first European Pach tour of Owen Olsen in Germany.
I fell in love with this red colour AG's... Deep orange-red is my favourite.

Here are my questions:
1. Who can tell me more about the history of growing red AG pumpkins?
2. How do I find seeds to try to grow red or orange-red pumpkins too?
3. How difficult it is to get a huge red AG, compaired with orange, white or green?

Thanks in advance for trying to answer these questuions, regards, Theo.

8/14/2006 12:40:24 PM

Netherlands

Nobody can ever predict the exact colour of any pumpkin. Certain genetics will usually produce a certain colour but even that is not for sure. Take a look at your own pumpkin that turned out to be a green squash. My 1287 Van Kooten is white while another grower in WA has a nice orange one going. The mother was kind of yellowish, I believe.

My 454 last year was red-orange. I can send you seeds but I cannot prove they will produce the same colour because I crossed it with another pumpkin.

That being said, there is no separate history to red AG pumpkins.

Your best bet would be to find a red pumpkin that was selfed. But even that would not be a guarantee.

8/14/2006 1:24:32 PM

Little-TON - Colorado

I heard that the color of the vine could show a leaning determination. T Or F?? I know that the Reiss I got from Martin in Germany is different that anything I ever grew.....Nice striped vine, punkin is yellow-orange and only 2 weeks old compared to my others that are white/creme......Im hoping to see this one to maturity....I getting more seeds out of it.

8/14/2006 1:48:51 PM

Menomonie, WI ([email protected])

801.5 Stelts yeppp yeppppp my favorite seed for color.

8/14/2006 3:27:33 PM

Utah

Here are three that I know of that people have considered red. "red" can be a relative term.

654 Troy 2001 (940 Mombert x open)
http://www.bigpumpkins.com/displayphoto.asp?pid=1113&gid=-3085
one offspring- that I know of it was orange.
736 Garrel 2003 (801.5 Stelts x 876 Lloyd)
http://www.bigpumpkins.com/displayphoto.asp?pid=2462&gid=28
no offspring that I no of.
627 Armstrong 2004 (869.5 Calai x open)
http://www.bigpumpkins.com/Diary/DiaryViewOne.asp?eid=29145
no offspring that I no of.

8/14/2006 3:36:37 PM

ordinary,VA

the 1048 companion im growing this year has a real nice dark orange will grow again next year.
810Dill x 801.5 Stelts might have something to do with the color :)
finally a big orange pumpkin i dont have to paint ooops i didnt say that.....

8/14/2006 3:39:35 PM

Nashville, TN

Genetically speaking:

The deepest red color is caused by the Rd (Red skin) gene. It is dominant to green, white, yellow and gray. Plants exhibiting this gene will have green vines, and green ovaries that slowly turn yellow-orange-then red after pollination and deepen as they mature. This gene was suspected to be in GPs - but never heavily looked for by researchers. In my research patch - I've identified at least three different varieties growing that are exhibiting the expected pattern for this gene - so it IS indeed in some of the GPs.

The most COMMON gene for yellow/orange color found in GPs is the Dominant B-gene. This gene causes the total lack of Chorophil production in the fruit, thus, the ovaries themselves will be yellow/white PRIOR to pollination. This gene also causes lack of chorophil production within other areas of the plant - namely, the vines will be striped or solid yellow in color.

Both the B-gene and Rs-gene are dominant over green. Many varieties will be carriers of the green gene - and if bred to other unidentified carrier lines - will produce up to 25% Giant Squash.

Should be just as easy to grow a 'big one' off of a Rs variety. It's just hard to find those lines, since no one has bothered to look for them and concentrate them. B-gene and Rs-gene can both theoretically exist within the same plant.

8/14/2006 4:02:56 PM

Buren Ameland,West Frisian Islands, Netherlands

Thanks all for your information!

Brad, I understand the difficulty with colour.
But isn't it that some seeds are producing a higher chance on a certain (orange) colour?
There is no seperate history to red AG's, fine. But what do growers who produced such huge red of 'red' AG's know about how it became red and what blood lines they have of them?
And who knows the growers who had these huge red ones?

Shannon, 801 Stelt is orange? More consistant than others?

Gordon, Many Thanks, very helpfull,I will try to find out more.

Ed, you may be have a few seeds from that nice deep orange pumpkin?
And what do you mean with DillxStelt has to do with colour?
Is it a more consitant orange pumpkin than others?

Cliff, very helpfull to explain these details, intersting too. Thanks.

8/14/2006 4:50:32 PM

Wallingford,CT

760Patrick99 comes to mind when looking for red gene pumpkins

8/14/2006 5:58:22 PM

Cincinnati,OH

Here is a picture of my 592 Rahe 04. It was a reddish one
http://www.bigpumpkins.com/Diary/DiaryViewOne.asp?eid=29507
It's a selfed seed and I have a pile of them.
I don't care for the long shape though.

8/14/2006 8:11:19 PM

Buren Ameland,West Frisian Islands, Netherlands

Ron,
Nice deep red-orange colour 592Rahe04. The long shape is less favourable to me, but even than is unsure you will get it from the seeds. Owen Olsen got a peanut shape pumpkin from the great shape Reiss her in Europe..
If you have a pile of them, why not have a try? :-)
I let you know.

8/15/2006 2:50:44 AM

Nashville, TN

There is no seperate history to red AG's, fine. B

Since GPs were originally created by crossing Hubbard Squashes with different Maxima Pumpkins - and red Hubbard (in particular) is a Rs gene variety.... the Rs gene most likely came from there. It is also found in Big Max pumpkins and possibly Prizewinner.

8/15/2006 6:45:26 AM

Lake Elmo, Minnesota

anything with 810 Dill will give good red, orange/red genetics.

8/15/2006 1:13:59 PM

Berlin,mi.([email protected])

THEO: take a look at these crosses. i think you would have a good chance of growing a nice red orange pumpkin with most of these seeds. if you would like some at the end of the season , just shoot me an email.
http://www.bigpumpkins.com/Diary/DiaryViewOne.asp?eid=55017

8/15/2006 1:24:26 PM